FACES OF PAIN CARE – EPISODE 11 – FREQUENCY SPECIFIC MICROCURRENT WITH DR. CAROLYN MCMAKIN
Learn more about Frequency Specific Microcurrent (FSM) from the developer, Dr. Carolyn McMakin. FSM is an exciting new way of treating nerve, muscle pain, and many other conditions using specific frequencies and micro amperage current.
Transcript (computer generated)
[00:00:05] Are you a health care professional who would like to hear from experts in the field of pain care or maybe you were caring for a family member who was experiencing pain or health challenges and you would like more information perhaps you are a healthcare educator wants to better inform your students or staff. Then you are in the right place. This is faces of Pain Care the show where we interview experts in the
[00:00:30] Shoulder pain care and now the co-creator of the wong-baker faces pain rating scale and the executive director of the wong-baker basis Foundation Connie Baker. Hello and welcome to faces of Pain Care. I am your host Connie Baker today. We're going to talk about frequency specific microcurrents FSM just rolls off the tongue. Doesn't it on a previous phases of Pain Care podcast. I interviewed. Dr. Alan Rosen.
[00:00:59] Esta pain medicine specialist at Cleveland Clinic. She was excited about the outcomes. They were seeing after using frequency specific microcurrents and I was intrigued as soon as we were finished talking. I began searching for more information on dr. Carolyn macon's website frequency specific.com. I even found a practitioner a mile from my office I contacted. Dr. McCann and she graciously agreed to join us on phases of pink hair.
[00:01:29] Let me tell you a little bit about her. Dr. Carolyn mcmakin developed frequency specific microcurrent in 1996 and began teaching it in 1997. She has a part-time practice consults with treat and treats professional teams. And Elite athletes does clinical research and teaches a FSM seminars in the US and abroad she has lectured at the National Institute of Health and at conferences on fibromyalgia and the differential
[00:02:00] Gnosis and treatment of chronic pain syndromes in the US Australia England and Germany. She has authored seven peer-reviewed articles for book chapters and to abstracts in the areas of chronic pain and differential diagnosis. Her textbook frequency specific microcurrent in pain management was published by elsevier in 2010. Her book The resonance effect how frequency specific microcurrent is changing medicine was
[00:02:29] Published by North Atlantic books in 2017. I read the resonance effect this weekend and I was captivated. It is Rich with stories at the development of this technology and the people it has helped and I highly recommend it. Dr. Mcmackin. I am thrilled for you to be joining us today. Thank you for being here. Thank you so much for having me Connie. It's delightful. Yeah. Well, this is going to be a great conversation. I'm really excited about what you're doing. Well tell me a little bit about how
[00:03:00] This was developed and and what brought you to begin working with frequency specific microcurrents.
[00:03:09] Well, I'm graduated from Chiropractic College when I was 47 years old. I graduated in 1994 started practice and I had a microcurrent machine in my office and my boyfriend at the time was a chiropractor who had worked with an osteopath and this osteopath bought a practice in 1946 that came with the machine that was made in 1922. Wow.
[00:03:38] That yeah that there were thousands of Physicians using electromagnetic therapies from about nineteen. Oh eight to about 19, but 1934 and in 1917, the AMA decreed that electromagnetic therapies herbs nutrition Homeopathy any anything except for drugs and surgery was not the way that medicine was going to practice and anybody that uses those alternative medicine methods would lose their license to practice.
[00:04:08] Which at that time was granted by the AMA. So the machines all went in the back room around the trash Heap and when they went in the back room, they got covered up by a sheet. So Harry Van girl who was an osteopath walk bought this Clinic when he moved from England to the u.s. Bought the clinic in 1946 walked in the back room, and there's machine with a shade over it. He pulls the sheet off and it was made in 1922 and it's got a list of frequencies. So being a curious Dutchman he started
[00:04:38] In the machine started using the frequencies.
[00:04:43] Observes effects and actually became quite famous in the western half of the United States and virtually all Canada because of his results in very serious conditions including cancer. I FSM and I don't treat camp.
[00:04:59] But Harry did so he
[00:05:08] George Douglas went to work with Harry and Ojai California for three months came back to Portland in 1986 with this list of frequencies put them in a drawer. He and I got together in 1991-92 and when I graduated from school, he bought me those Channel microcurrent machine and then in 1987 695 stumbled across
[00:05:37] Piece of paper with the frequencies on it in a drawer is kind of a pack rat. So I called the frequency out and we looked at it and he said well this machine has two channels like that microcurrent machine. I wonder if the frequencies of
[00:05:53] Work on I don't know. Let's see. So we started using it on ourselves and then we started using it on my difficult patients in the clinic because at that point I had left lectured on fibromyalgia and myofascial pain for Portland State University and that was beginning to be the focus of my practice. So we started using the frequencies in the clinic in 95.
[00:06:21] If working together in 96, I started using it on my own and we had a machine that had graphite gloves with it to do facials because I was new and practice and I wanted a little something extra. So we used the graphite gloves and the frequencies on this patient that had myofascial trigger points in his neck that were making him dizzy.
[00:06:43] And it was it was just inspiration. Basically just desperation. Yeah, I've been working on the man who for three months and he wasn't getting anywhere and so the frequencies and the current combined turned his neck muscles.
[00:07:02] Stu pudding and it was visit fixed it was done. Wow. So after that we start seeing the frequencies and back then we use the graphite gloves now. We just hook the machine up to warm wet towels and
[00:07:16] So we started which is myofascial trigger points. I was a manual trigger point therapist. I'm a chiropractor and it's
[00:07:29] 798 we figured out how to treat nerve pain. There's frequency to reduce inflammation. There's a frequency for the nerve. Well, everybody knows that painful nerves are inflamed. So we're an inflammation in the nerve and
[00:07:42] So I can radiculopathy just go away 20 to 30 minutes and then you had time to heal the disc and keep the patient out of pain 99. We figure it out that patients with full body pain. We call fibromyalgia who got their pain following an auto accident or some sort of spine trauma that their spinal cord was inflamed. So I happen to pick the free to reduce inflammation and the frequency to Target the spine.
[00:08:11] Gordon so there's a frequency for a condition frequency for tissue and we reduced inflammation 40 Hertz and targeted the spinal cord 10 Hertz and on c99 WE 25 patients 25 patients that came in with their pain at an average of 27.4 on opiates. So opt for this kind of pain. It just fixes it so you don't mind it so much 25 out of 25 pain went from
[00:08:41] An average of seven to an average of one.
[00:08:45] Wow, so I present that those yeah, it was extraordinary and I presented those cases at a grand rounds at NIH in 2000 March. I think thanks to Jay Shaw. He's a physiatrist at NIH that was interested in the myofascial pain work and and at the end of the 60 minute lecture I said we've done this 20 phone.
[00:09:10] Five times there's nobody at doesn't work on and nobody's going to believe it unless we have something objective. So Terry Phillips was a micro immunochemical chemist and he came up and said I can tell you what's changing. So we got a patient in took a blood spot and put it on special blotter paper and sin.
[00:09:31] That to Terry the blood spot before treatment and then a different about every 20 to 30 minutes during a treatment and in 90 minutes is patient one from an hour from a pain level about an eight and a half down to a zero and four weeks later. We got the data back and what happens when you run that frequency combination in that patient group is that they're all of their inflammatory cytokines which are peptides.
[00:10:01] That mediate inflammation drop
[00:10:05] At logarithmic rates like 45 degree angle down by factors of 10 20 time and it's like okay, there's something clearly changing and the endorphins go up by a factor of ten times. So they went from 8 to 88 and the patient's get frankly stoned. It's they do it's like giving him half a cc of versed for people that are familiar with that drug. Maybe CC they can still wake up.
[00:10:34] You can always them but they would rather keep their eyes closed and their pains gone. It's a zero. Hmm. No, it takes reputable only had two patients out of over 300 that
[00:10:47] Got better in one one session one was a woman one was a police officer was man the rather.
[00:10:54] Steven you have to keep the pain below for for six to eight weeks and then the endocrine system recovers the nervous system recovers the spinal cord heals itself the discs repair themselves and the average recovery time for fibromyalgia is for months. Wow, they no longer meet the diagnostic criteria, usually at the end of 8 to 12 weeks, but then it takes some time to rehab and recondition. So that's that's the history. I
[00:11:23] Started teaching it in 97 really to find out if it was reproducible.
[00:11:29] Kept teaching at once we found out it was reproducible. I kept teaching it because it would be immoral not to and I'm so I'm now taught in the u.s. Ireland Australia, Germany.
[00:11:45] Kuwait we have 25 medical physicians in Kuwait. It was approved for category 1 CME credit by the Kuwaiti Physical Medicine and Rehab Association. So it's it just keeps working and I teach it it's like teaching a language and then the Physicians who learn it and use it have to figure out how to implement it and to hear the people at Cleveland Clinic.
[00:12:15] And and and Walter Reed and st. Mary's and the spinal cord Institute in Denver and Chicago hear what they're doing in Inpatient Rehab and Recovery is really quite extraordinary. So the fact
[00:12:31] That it's working its Reaper goal is just incredibly rewarding. Yeah. Yeah, I was fascinated by that and the help that it gives for people who have post-traumatic stress. Yeah. It's probably a lot of what's happening at Walter Reed. I would guess.
[00:12:55] The challenge they want to read they're actually doing more with the pain syndromes that Walter made the challenge. They have at Walter Reed has that the PTSD protocol takes two hours and they don't have that kind of a time slot and you don't have to be with the patient. There's nothing Hands-On about it. It's automated. It's been in use for 10 years. We haven't found anybody. It doesn't work on punch a button leave the room and then after the first Ritz about eight sessions in six weeks and
[00:13:24] And the symptoms start changing after the first or second session. They stop having nightmares the flashbacks get easier. Then you have to with reduce medications until you get down to the what they actually need or what they don't need at all.
[00:13:43] And but it's two hours it takes time. So we have we it just it just takes time because you're treating all of the brain parts now, it's theoretically we could shorten it. But the problem is that one of our practitioners develop this protocol and we don't know what piece of it is crucial. It's it's been in use we've been testing it for 10 years. We got problems.
[00:14:11] 25 practitioners in the PTSD special interest group and they've been using it for 10 years. We have lots of case reports. It never doesn't work. It always works. We just don't know which parts of it are crucial so we don't know how to shorten it and nobody wants to for right and it's you know, it's important to also note that something that you said in the book that you can't use the wrong.
[00:14:41] You can't damage yourself. Like if you use the wrong frequency, it's not going to be a problem. But you just know when it works you, you know, you can tell when it's the right frequency and that's what you work with. Sometimes you're even having to guess a little play around with it a little bit and using your intuition as you described to identify if it's inflammation or you know or scar tissue or you know, so the the
[00:15:11] Was the first thing George and I did was use it on ourselves my kids our neighbors to find out if the frequency was incorrect would it do any harm so they're their work. They don't work there only two exceptions to this one is when a patient has an infection that you don't think is an infection. So somebody has a had knee surgery and the knee is still painful, but the white count is normal and
[00:15:40] Nobody has identified an infection you were on the frequency to reduce inflammation and the frequency overrides the signaling that causes the immune system to respond for infection and it turns off inflammation. Well during the two and a half to three hours at the
[00:16:00] Inflammation is turned off the infection proliferates because the immune system is using inflammation as a way of containing infection. So that is the actual frequency the one frequency precaution.
[00:16:17] Contraindication if you well is you can't use the frequency to read inflammation if there is an infection present and then the other frequency that's that's there's a precaution about is if patient has a new injury that's less than six weeks old and you run the frequencies to dissolve Scar Tissue, it will dissolve the scar tissue in the body needs that repair tissue to heal. So it will set back healing so that those inadvertent responses were part of the way we
[00:16:46] Actually found out that the frequencies always.
[00:16:50] Do exactly what they're described as doing whether that's what you intend to do or not. Right whose frequency is increased secretions increases secretions. So we if you increase secretions in the lung that creates problem. Mmm increased secretions in the nerve in a patient with nerve atrophy.
[00:17:18] That is helpful MMC. Be aware FSM practitioners in general have to be brighter than the average bear because the
[00:17:28] Frequencies will do exactly what you tell them to do. And only what you told them do. So the practitioners have to be aware like there's a frequency for in.
[00:17:40] Increasing secretion. There's a frequency for the kidney. Well, the kidney is an endocrine organ and you some of the secretions of the kidney are good and some of the secretions the kidney increased blood pressure change red blood cells. You don't want to increase secretions in the kidney. Mmm-hmm. So all of those precautions are what I teach in this fort a seminar we teach the frequencies how to use them. And we also teach where to be careful. Mmm. That's pretty important, you know.
[00:18:10] Something else that you brought up in the book that I thought was really intriguing in the chapter on more than frequencies. It's something that I've noticed and I had fibromyalgia for 18 years, but don't have any of those symptoms anymore. But you talk about an important issue that is often overlooked. You might be able to help somebody relieve their pain with the FSM, but people who have had chronic pain for quite a while have a transition from
[00:18:40] Um being a pain patient to being pain-free. Oh, it's that was in the fibromyalgia group. That was a really important Discovery was we had 58 patients and out of the 58. There were 13 that every all 58 had their pain go from an average of seven to an average of one where so they all got out of pain out of that group. There were 13 that that came for one or two.
[00:19:10] Maybe three sessions and then stopped coming and it wasn't treatment side effects. It wasn't treatment cost it was they stopped coming and it took me a number of years to figure out that what we were doing basically created an existential crisis that is unparalleled in medicine. If you've been in pain for 14 years and at the end of 90 minutes you are out of pain, who are you really? Yeah, right, so,
[00:19:40] Five ten years down the track. I've we found frequencies to help with that by dealing with the part of the brain that amplifies pain. So the amygdala and the midbrain is the part that effectively identifies you with your pain and it creates Central sensitization. So it's I think it were more successful with helping people through this transition and
[00:20:10] These days I want them. It's like this is this is what's coming. Everything is different. It's not going to be usually the pain relief is not permanent when the pink is back. It's not going to be any worse, but you're going to find it more it will frighten you and it'll make you angry. So just hang in there and by the second or third treatment patients come in expecting it to work after the first one. They're skeptical after the second one that less.
[00:20:40] Possible after the third one they come in at the third or fourth session and say okay. Let's get me out of pain. This is annoying. Mhm these days we have home units when people can keep themselves out of pain on an ongoing basis because that's basically what it takes to get rid of the fibromyalgia is to keep your pain below a four for four to six weeks and then the endocrine system seems to recover its pretty fun interesting.
[00:21:10] Interesting. Well that you know, and I've sometimes ask a person what would they see them doing themselves doing if they were pain-free what would their life look like? And because it really is quite a transformation and you describe that people who aren't so much identifying themselves as a pain patient, but ready to get rid of it and ready to move on are more successful.
[00:21:40] And making the change the reason yeah, they're easier to easier to treat because they're that's they already see themselves there. I have never successfully gotten a patient to recover who was on a fentanyl patch. No offense the fentanyl but it's just too addictive. They can't they can't make that transition and the other Universal non-success are the two patients. I've treated that were
[00:22:12] Chairman or president of the fibromyalgia screw right into different cities. So if there if there are any identity is involved in being a fibromyalgia patient, then who are they have they recovered that's nothing against the patient. It's just one of the realities of our life. Right? Right. So it's there's another thing that comes up there are frequencies for different emotional states, and there are some
[00:22:41] Petitioners that make the assumption that certain pain syndromes or symptoms are emotional in nature the patient's anger or fear or grief or whatever is creating this pain, so
[00:23:00] Over the years there is a frequency of for those emotions and if it doesn't work, it's not emotional. So I've tended away from that assumption that patients pain is due to their emotional state because so many
[00:23:22] The patient's I mean have been in pain been told it was all in their head been told it was emotional and it's disc for set. It's something fairly easy to fix abdominal adhesions and pelvic pain if that was the only thing we did it would be miraculous.
[00:23:40] It's the frequencies actually dissolve scar tissue in the abdomen and these patients have been in pain for 5, 10 15 years become pain free.
[00:23:55] Part of the challenge. We have one see specific is that it's good for too many things. There's a it makes it suspect right snake. Well, it's like know which is physical but there's a frequency that the only thing it's good for is acute shingles. Hmm, and I have friend of mine used that here and it was very successful. Yes. Yeah. We haven't found anybody doesn't work on. Yeah. So in the acute phase of shingles, they're out of pain generally in 20 to 30 minutes, but you have to run it for two hours to actually abort the attack to stop it.
[00:24:25] So their pain free in the lesions are gone and to two hours at lesions dry up overnight. That's crazy. Right? Kidney stone pain. There's one frequency combination for pressure in the ureter only thing it's good for is kidney stone paint. That's it. It's fascinating fascinating what's you know, it's a lot of people don't understand. I mean, it's it does sound it's hard to get your head around it. If you're not used to this kind.
[00:24:55] Kind of Technology, but so use the example that use about the car fob. Okay, so we are used to as a culture we are used to drugs and even supplement as therapeutic. They have a predictable reproducible effect on body chemistry and drugs and nutrients work to change the way your cells work the way.
[00:25:25] Key goes into your car door lock and changes the cell membrane receptors like a key in a lock. It lands on them causes a change in configuration and the receptor goes from closed to open open closed and the frequencies work by signaling. So the frequencies change cell membrane receptor configuration and cell function.
[00:25:55] The same way your key fob opens that same car door lock with a signal from 20 feet away or the trunk or all the all the doors. Yes, exactly turns on the light might even start the car. Oh, I wish I had one of those. So yeah, so it's it's a it's a paradigm that is easier to talk about
[00:26:25] Now that we have key fobs that open our card or from 20 feet away because the analogy is perfect. Drugs are like the key in a lock. The frequencies are like the magnetic signal the key fob that opens the door same same effect just a different mechanism for doing it and both are equally credible. It's just physics just physics. Right? It's I have been we've had people who wanted to make it pretty whoo.
[00:26:55] It's electromagnets like no, it's just physics. It's biophysics. It's predictable. It's reproducible. It is consistent and there are mechanisms within the biophysics community that makes sense for how it works and those mechanisms match what we observe in the clinic. So it's it's the perfect combination of clinical science and physical science that that explains what we're doing and propels.
[00:27:24] As the research forward. So right now we have groups around the country that are doing clinical research just to document the effects and were trying to work with genetics companies that can measure the changes in cell membrane structure and genetic expression because when the when the frequencies change the cell membrane receptors those receptors change cell function, the only thing that explains the draw
[00:27:55] Inflammatory cytokines and the drop in Lipe oxygenase and cyclooxygenase is that the cell's genetic expression changes dramatically and very quickly. So those those inflammatory products just disappear. They just dropped but they all stopped in the normal range. The only way that could happen is cell signaling well and that all happened that was the story back where you had the fibromyalgia patients with the blood.
[00:28:24] Bud where you took the blood during the treatments and could identify those cytokines and that was a game changer as you described in the book presenting to a group of people, I mean they they couldn't argue with that and it was there were a lot of drop Jaws I would think there were I mean to this day anybody neither that knows cytokine chemistry and at the time we got that data, I didn't know.
[00:28:55] Think about it. There wasn't Google there wasn't Wikipedia. It was March or was so I didn't know whether it was significant or not. So it was presenting it at the institute for functional medicine and I showed the raw data to Jeff Bland. Who's the one that started the functional medicine movement and he said call Michael rough. He and Candace pert did the original work on cytokines and he'll be able to tell you whether that is significant. So I called him and I said he said yeah.
[00:29:26] And I just needed some text about cytokines said sure what a numbers and I said well interleukin-1 goes from 392 down to 21.
[00:29:35] And the line got really quiet. He said what time frame as well 90 minutes. He said that's not and there was like the line went dead and he came back on and he said that's not possible cytokines are hard to change in when they change they change slowly over months and I said, no they are not they are all like that so we had data on interleukin-1 interleukin 6 interferon gamma T tnf-alpha CGR PLS
[00:30:05] He whole raft of cytokines.
[00:30:11] And who did your data I said Mike Terry Phillips the same guy that does your data as well. He's the best in the world. He said I have absolutely no idea what you're doing, but it's extraordinary. So it took really 15 years to get a real appreciation for what where and how extraordinary these changes are and the because they all stopped in the normal range. The only thing that explains them as that
[00:30:40] Changing cellular genetics by changing cells signaling the problem with the anti cytokine drugs the Biologicals that they're using in autoimmune conditions is they drop the cytokines below the normal level and then the patients get infections and cancer. So there is a certain level of cytokines that you need to prevent infection and prevent cancer and when you don't have them that's a problem. So the
[00:31:10] The frequencies drop them like a stone but stopped in the normal range. So we are side effect profile on our long-term outcomes are extraordinary.
[00:31:21] There are no
[00:31:24] All apparent long-term ready? You can drop inflammation like a rock and not affect your gastrointestinal system. Your GI system is not like take a nap. The inflammation is going to the prostaglandins are going to be down for 24 to 48 hours. It's not like taking celebrex where it's going to be down for 24 to 48 hours. It's down for four to six hours if your body time to get on top of it, hmm and and go back to normal.
[00:31:54] Function so it's just been a just a wonderful learning curve for how the Body Works what causes what kind of pain so there are times when when we do a practicum in a seminar low back pain, there are muscle spasms or tightness just tight tight muscles in the soyuz. It's a big muscle in the abdomen and on dradis lumborum this big low back muscle.
[00:32:24] Well, we treat the muscle treat the nerve treat.
[00:32:28] Disc nothing changes when we and it took 10 12 years you're out to do that when we treated scarring in the ureter. So the kidney the ureter runs right along the so ABS in the front and if you these patients where this works all had kidney infections kidney stones clatter infections that inflame the ureter caused it to stack to the front of the so as fascia.
[00:32:58] Cerebellum tightens that muscle and creates back pain.
[00:33:03] Wow, if you remove that muscle, you would injure the ureter which is important. So muscles are tight patient has back pain people work on them. They'd stretch there. So as they stretch the low back we dissolve the adhesions between the ureter and the faccia the muscle relaxants that goes away and it's instant and it's permanent who would have guessed know 20 years. Yeah. Well, you have to be a detective when you're doing
[00:33:33] Us to figure out and and really know your Anatomy.
[00:33:39] It certainly helps I did well in anatomy in school, but I lived with Netter which is an illustrated Anatomy book. I lived with it open on my lap or on the counter next to me for 5 years. Yeah, that's how I actually learned in that Ami now. Wow. Well, there's just so much that you're able to address.
[00:34:05] Even though emotional like for fibromyalgia, it's not all on all in their head. But sometimes you found there were instances where the only way you could get.
[00:34:19] The pain to improve or be relieved is using some of the emotional frequencies because of what was happening at the at the time and and so the history became even more important to you in determining which frequencies you were going to use.
[00:34:38] Exactly. And so the lawyer that had low back pain and I did his usual stuff.
[00:34:45] Sets and miles and it didn't work right and then I just ran the frequency for grief and his lower back started to relax and ran through the different emotional frequencies and it turns out that he was having trouble in his marriage and that's how we got rid of his back pain. So when it's emotional that's what works. It's just fascinating. So, how do you how can we I know that people listening are going to want to find a
[00:35:15] Practitioner. I know you have on your website a list of practitioners. What what would you recommend that people do to to find somebody in their area?
[00:35:27] Well first I recommend and the read the resonance effect so that they know what they're getting into. I agree because really been easy to an entree to how it was developed what it does what you can expect frequency specific.com as our website we have about 1800 practitioner. There's in the west and some odd and Australia hundred and twenty or Thirty and Ireland and then scattered around the world. There are other ones and we have a
[00:35:57] Your list on the website that we're hoping is now closer to correct. It was wrong for quite a few years and then the last about three days ago. It went live with the new updated practitioner list. I suggest that when you find somebody in your area you can put a zip code in it will locate a practitioner call that practitioner and see if they're comfortable treating what you have see if they still do FSM because it doesn't suit everybody's intellect does.
[00:36:26] Not suit them their practice model or their time schedule. It's it's it's not something that suits everybody. So not everybody that started with FSM is continued. So call the office find out if they're comfortable treating what you have. So if what you have is abdominal pain and pelvic could you know adhesions and this person as a physical therapist and specializes in necks and shoulders. It's you have to make sure it's a good fit. Right, right.
[00:36:57] Practitioners around the country that treat macular degeneration. We have a published paper on the other practitioners around the country. It's not part of their scope of practice and I don't recommend that they treat macular degeneration, but in early to Middle stages effective, so if people have a question, can they get more information at your office? Yes. Okay, right. They'll be a contact us.
[00:37:27] On the website or you can call 360 6957 500. Oh, that's the the office phone number or you can you can
[00:37:40] Communicate by email outside. There's a contact at frequencies specific.com perfect on OK and implements also want to I'm sure like me find out how to learn more and attend your classes. So that's also available on frequency specific.com. So people feel we I hope that people will visit those sites and read your book because it was that's a game changer for
[00:38:10] I'll tell you that's great. I'm really glad to hear it the other seminars gone from two days to three days and this fall they finally went to four days. It's a 926 were in Jacksonville and Chicago Jacksonville and September Chicago in October Cleveland Clinic. It will be we think approved for category.
[00:38:33] One continued magic medical education credit Phoenix's and February Portland. And then we have the schedule set for next year. Wow here that's on the website is yeah, that's a full schedule. Well, I appreciate you making time for us today. My pleasure getting the word out is the is the is the next step is the step is not only to to get people to get to their practitioners but to get relief to patients.
[00:39:03] That's why we do this right is to find relief for patients who have really no other good answers in medicine. There's it's so yeah, I'm happy to do the interview good. Well, thank you and appreciate that a real pleasure.
[00:39:21] And listeners, you can learn more about dr. McCann and frequency specific microcurrent at their website again, we've mentioned it several times, but it's www dot frequency specific.com and then Brittany or Kevin can help you find a practitioner if you need more help than what's on their website. You can contact them at 360 6957 500 and listeners. We would love to hear from you, please please.
[00:39:50] Visit our website at wong-baker faces dot-org or email us at wong-baker faces at gmail.com. Thank you for joining us today, and thank you for making a positive difference in someone's life. Have a great day.
[00:40:08] This has been another great episode of faces of Pain Care. Thank you for listening. Don't forget to subscribe on iTunes. So you don't miss any of the new episodes and be sure you check our previous shows for more information that will keep you informed and inspired.